Imposter Syndrome, Negative Self-Talk, and the Big Fat Lies We Believe.

Have you ever walked into a room and immediately thought, “What am I doing here?” Maybe you were waiting for someone to tap you on the shoulder and say, “Ma’am, there has been a mistake. You do not belong here.” Congratulations, friend, you have met imposter syndrome—and in this episode, we are calling it out for exactly what it is: a big, fat lie.

In this episode of Breakthrough with Mallory and Julie, Julie Burch and Mallory Herron dig into the sneaky, exhausting, and wildly common experience of feeling like you are not enough, even when all the evidence says otherwise. From leadership rooms and networking groups to big speaking stages, award galas, salary conversations, and career risks, imposter syndrome has a nasty little habit of showing up right when you are trying to grow.

Julie and Mallory talk about how negative self-talk fuels self-doubt, why comparison is gasoline on the imposter syndrome fire, and how even wildly successful, talented, high-achieving people can still feel like they are one wrong move away from being “found out.” They also share real stories about feeling out of place, questioning their own value, underpricing themselves, and learning to reframe discomfort as a sign of growth instead of proof that they do not belong.

This episode is packed with practical tools to help you stop spiraling and start taking back control. You will hear how to use the Five Whys to get to the root of your insecurity, how to name your inner critic, how to create a confidence file, and why focusing on action instead of identity can help you move forward even when you do not feel ready. Because spoiler alert: confidence does not come from knowing everything. Confidence comes from taking action, figuring it out, and keeping the promises you make to yourself.

Julie and Mallory also introduce their new Fan Mail Five segment, answering a listener question about feeling trapped, ambition, workplace politics, and tough career choices. Their answer brings it all back to agency over self: identifying what you can control, choosing your next move with intention, and refusing to hand your power over to people, systems, or situations that do not get to define you.

Whether you are a leader, entrepreneur, speaker, professional, working mom, career changer, or just someone who has ever thought, “Who am I to do this?”—this episode is your reminder that you are not alone, you are not a fraud, and you are not required to wait until you feel 100% ready before you make your next bold move.

It is time to stop letting imposter syndrome run the meeting, set the price, silence your voice, or keep you out of rooms you were invited into for a reason.

Listen now and learn how to shut down self-doubt, own your value, and break through to the next version of you.

If you want your question answered on Fan Mail Five, you can ask Mallory and Julie a question by clicking the button at the top of the show notes and send us a text message or voicemail and you may end up on the air!

You can also reach us on our website breakthroughwmj.com or our social media!

Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:15

Have you ever walked into a room and immediately thought, What am I doing here? Like you're in this room and you're just waiting for that person to come up to you and tap you on the shoulder and say, uh, ma'am, you're gonna need to pack it up. This isn't for you. We probably all have felt that way. And actually, interestingly, I think some of the most like wildly successful, amazing people, talented, skilled people that we know have felt that way too. It's called imposter syndrome. And today we're gonna call it out as what it is a big fat lie. My name's Julie Birch, and thank you for joining Breakthrough with Mallory and Julie. I'm a professional speaker, author, podcaster, and I do feel like I'm fighting my war on self-abdication. My goal is to help you take back control, agency over self, be intentional in what you do, and to break through to the new you.

SPEAKER_01 1:15

I love it. And hi, I'm Mallory Heron, wife, mom, CEO, speaker, author, dog mom, and podcaster. And I have been self-diagnosed with imposter syndrome, but I'm not alone. A lot more people than you might assume actually deal with it regularly. So I've got some statistics for you. I'll put the uh citations for the sources. We can put it in the show notes. Okay. So 78% of leaders experience imposter syndrome at some point in their career. That's most people. 79% of women and 62% of men regularly feel a lack of confidence at work is holding them back. 82% of leaders from another study, they report feeling unprepared for their roles. We're all just faking it till we make it. And interestingly, I think a lot of imposter syndrome comes from the things we tell ourselves, the voices in our head, our inner monologue, and because something is telling you, oh, you don't belong here. This isn't the room for you. And women are more likely to engage in negative self-talk and criticize themselves more than four times a day.

SPEAKER_00 2:32

I think four is an actually low number. My guess is it's a lot higher. We talk to ourselves all the time and we tell ourselves all the bad stuff, don't we? I mean, even just in the most innocuous kind of situations, you know, you're driving and you miss your turn and you, oh, I'm so stupid. I'm such an idiot. And I can't believe that I'd miss that. What am I what's wrong with me? We tell ourselves all the time the things that we're bad at, the things that we don't do well. And unfortunately, like our subconscious can't take a joke and believes some of that stuff, and it tells we tend to cling to the negative, and it is not effective.

SPEAKER_01 3:07

No, and I you are going to only get more belief in your inability or that you are an imposter the more you're ruminating in that negativity. I so this is a I guess it's a fun story. Um I have always felt imposter syndrome. Despite being a speaker, despite winning awards for my work that are pretty big awards, I still feel like, well, I don't have my college degree, and at any time people are gonna say, What are you doing? You've pulled the wool over my eyes. And I'm not trying to manipulate anyone or paint myself in a different way. I'm very transparent. But this became really clear to me with a networking group that I had joined. So there was this very elite, exclusive networking group that I didn't know existed. They had reached out to me as someone they wanted to fill this particular vertical for HR, and they were trying to find the right person because they're very like it's the best of the best top of their career people that are in this group. And they had reached out to me. I was intrigued. I went through this like six-month-long vetting process where they determined, you know, was I at the level to join their group? And this is like CEOs of banks, of private equity firms, like career titans. And they have a speaker come in every week where they meet at a country club, and the speakers are also powerhouses in their industries and like politicians, all kinds of people. And when I started going to this networking group, the people were all amazing, lovely, caring, warm individuals. But I felt so out of place in that room. I just felt like I'm not on the same level. I I know I'm not earning as much as everybody else here. I haven't been in business as long as some of the people here. At any moment, they're going to say, We made a mistake. You don't actually belong here. And I let that unfortunately be part of my decision to leave. So I was actually doing uh more speaking engagements, so I just wasn't able to attend as regularly. So, you know, success, we love it. But and my kids were going through some stuff, but the deciding factor part of that was, well, I don't really belong there anyway. So I took a step back and went into like an inactive status. And then at the end of last year, they came back and asked me to come back and join them again.

SPEAKER_00 5:49

That's awesome.

SPEAKER_01 5:50

And even though they'd asked me to join them the first time and I felt like an imposter, I got to go back last week and be in that room again. And I finally felt like, yeah, I do belong here. But it was only after they had asked me to come back. Isn't that wild?

SPEAKER_00 6:05

It is wild. I and I don't think you're alone in that feeling. And I go back and forth, I kind of waffle on this because I think part of it is that you have to see your value for other people to see your value. On the other hand, I think it really what your your experience illustrates is that sometimes it other people see it before you see it. And if you're invited into that room, you're there for a reason. We have to, we have to see that. We have to recognize that value that we bring. You were invited because you bring something to the table. And I I always actually look at it uh well, the way that I try to kind of reframe it is that if I'm uncomfortable, that's a good thing. Because what that says is that I'm I'm upgrading, I'm leveling up. I don't, I really don't think it's that you don't belong. I think it's that you're growing, you're leveling up. And that's who you need and want to be around, right? Are those people that help you level up? And I think that's very powerful. But imposter syndrome can play a lot of tricks on how we interact with people, what risks we're willing to take, what actions we're willing to take. And we will we will end up just stuck where we are out of fear of what might be. And I think sometimes you have to just own it. You just have to make the bold statement, take the bold step, and walk in there. I I kind of tell a story that this was one of those moments when I felt imposter syndrome initially, but really got a great lesson. And like your experience where they the person had to kind of remind you, I had booked this amazing speaking engagement and I was feeling pretty comfortable. It was a big keynote presentation, big audience, big stage. And when I walked into the room and I saw how big it actually was, I had that moment of, oh, holy smokes. I mean, did I prepare enough? Am I good enough for this? Can I, is this gonna resonate? Did I do enough, you know, due diligence and homework on this? And and I started to doubt myself. But I got up there and I did what I had to do. And one of my, it was it became one of my favorite compliments I got. After my presentation, the CEO of the company told me that I was, I was exceptional. But what he said was, you charge way too little. I was like, oh man, that's a great compliment. But imposter syndrome is one of those things that holds us back. We don't ask for the salary, we don't ask for the raise, we don't, we hate to name our own price. We negotiate before we're asked to negotiate. And I think that part of that imposter syndrome, we have to reframe it so that we're seeing the value that we bring instead of telling ourselves all the bad stuff.

SPEAKER_01 8:37

100%. And again, going back to the point of like you see yourself differently than you should see yourself. Julie has been my favorite speaker for years. She's the reason why I wanted to become a speaker. She's the one that I wanted to be most like. And I still pinch myself that I know her and I get to do a podcast with her, and I go home and like fangirl with my husband, like, yeah, I got to talk with Julie today. And he like I could not imagine someone thinking Julie is less than she is because she is amazing. But we are our own worst critic, and we have a skewed view of ourselves and our accomplishments. And I do think that it's important to become comfortable with being uncomfortable. Use that as a data point instead of letting it hold you back. Right. I personally am far more comfortable in a dive bar than I am at a really fancy formal event. And we were actually recently at a fancy formal event. And it was the it was a Gallif and it was like uh awards for our industry. And I'd actually won one the year prior, but was sick and couldn't go. So this time I went and I wasn't, you know, my name was not in the running for any awards. Julie was MCing. She did a phenomenal job, as always. But I, you know, and I had this like nice pretty gown. I might have still gotten it off Amazon. Gorgeous! Sequence will do a lot for you. Um, but I I I it's like a nice dinner. I took my drink ticket, went to the bar, and asked for uh just a Coke because it was a long drive and I didn't want to drink. And the bartender took a can of Coke and he started pouring it into a glass. And I said, Oh no, you you don't have to do that. I'll just take the Coke can. And he kind of protested a little bit. And I was like, Okay, well, no big deal. I'll just go ahead and take the Coke can and the glass back to my table, put it on my table, and then told Julie, Oh, that's not classy. I messed up.

SPEAKER_00 10:47

I should not have taken the Coke can. Nobody else at the table was looking at the Coke can. Everybody was so focused on themselves and what they were doing and the selfies they were taking, and truly nobody noticed. But that's part of what happens, is that I think we, and really, I will tell you, to me, that's like a very big point in the context of understanding imposter syndrome, is that it's the comparison fuels our imposter syndrome because we compare ourselves to others. But and I know that I'm not the first person to say this, probably every one of our listeners has heard this, but you can't compare your life to someone else's highlight reel. And that's what I think we do is that we see the highlights, and social media has just made this even worse, hasn't it? Because people don't post their their you know, crappy stuff. They post their highlights and we look at it and go, well, man, look what they're doing. Look at how sexful successful they are, look at the stage they're on. And when we do that, we're comparing our entire life to that one highlight reel. And that is not where we want to be. You know, we tend to make the assumption that everyone else must know what they're doing. And you know what? I've got news for you. Nobody knows what they're doing. That's my theory.

SPEAKER_01 12:03

Yeah, we're all we we become adults and then just pretend we know until we actually figure it out. And but everyone's doing that. And even with the story with the cocaine, I'm the only one paying attention to it. To me, that was a reinforcement of, oh, I don't belong in this kind of environment. But I had a great time, I want to belong in that kind of environment. So it's just data that I can use because I am comfortable being out of my comfort zone for the most part. And comparison, everything is set up, especially online, where we're just kind of naturally comparing ourselves to others all the time. But comparison is the thief of joy, which is something I heard on Sister Wives.

SPEAKER_00 12:47

So wisdom from Sister Wives.

SPEAKER_01 12:49

I, you know, it its intent was to get the women to like not fight with each other. And I don't know if they came up with that or if it came somewhere else, but I mean it's applicable outside of plural marriages on the TLC channel. So I try to only compare myself to myself yesterday, the day before, something like that. And really truly take the the imposter syndrome that I'm feeling and try to, okay, why do I feel that way? So that I can do something about it.

SPEAKER_00 13:23

Right. What where is that coming from? Generally, when we feel inadequate, it's the areas with there's it stems from somewhere, some childhood trauma, something, you know, your village villa villain origin story, whatever it is. Those things that that have are deep, but until we are able to identify them and stop, right? We have to reframe it, we have to give ourselves a new perspective. Uh, it's very difficult because those things will continue to haunt us. And genuinely, we don't know always where they came from. Unless you've done a lot of therapy, most of us have no clue where some of that trauma comes from. And it's holding us back. It's the way we talk to ourselves, it's it's the fights that we have when we don't even know why, right? When you get mad about something, why am I so mad about this? What is this saying about me? When did this become a problem for me in the past? Then now I feel like I have to overcompensate or I have to be scrappy. And I think there's something to be said for recognizing what those triggers are for you.

SPEAKER_01 14:23

Absolutely. I I also think that you've got to treat the cause, not the symptom.

SPEAKER_00 14:28

Right.

SPEAKER_01 14:28

So notice when you feel the imposter syndrome, try to look for patterns. Is it certain situations, certain people, certain events? Where am I feeling this way? So that now you can start digging to okay, but why? Right. So I use the five whys. Have you you've heard of that, right?

SPEAKER_00 14:48

Yeah, it's great.

SPEAKER_01 14:49

So I believe Toyota uses it, but it's a root cause analysis and it's pretty simple to do. So you ask yourself why five times. That's literally it. You say, Oh, I'm feeling like I don't belong. I'm feeling imposter syndrome. Okay, why? Well, the people in this room uh have degrees and I don't. Why do I feel some type of way about that? Oh, I don't feel like I'm good enough because I didn't get my degree. Okay, well, why? And you just keep asking why until you get to the part where you're like, oh, that's where it all stems from. And once you can identify it, now you can challenge it. That's right.

SPEAKER_00 15:28

We have so much kind of baggage. Um, I have a good friend Monica who calls it junk in the trunk. And I've just always that's just always resonated. It's that junk in the trunk, it's the baggage that we carry that is we've been carrying it for so long, oftentimes I don't even think we realize that it's there, but it's creating in us. It it evokes action, it evokes motion emotion, and it it makes us move in a certain direction and why we react to things the way that we react to things. I recently went to a conference and it was amazing. And the the speaker, Rachel Hollis, if anybody's familiar with Rachel Hollis, she wrote the book, uh, Girl Wash Your Face and others. She's she's remarkable. And this was something that she brought up, and it's something I've actually worked with with some of my audiences in the past as well. It's kind of identifying what is that negative self-talk? What are you saying to yourself? And I am firmly believe that this can be an exercise that can really help us is to just take 60 seconds, take three minutes, whatever it is, and just to free write, don't worry about punctuation or grammar, just write. What are the negative things that you tell yourself? I'm not smart enough, I'm not educated enough, I am not thin enough, I'm not pretty enough, I'm not, I don't have the experience, I haven't been doing it as long. Whatever those things are, those messages that you tell yourself that uh, you know, just kind of repeat in your head that that's what's coming out in that imposter syndrome. Write those things down. And then I'm all about giving it a name. And we've talked about this before, that it's you know, it's kind of your evil twin, but not your twin. Yeah. You and I I'm all about it. Give them a name. What do you name yours? Nancy. Nancy. Because she's negative Nancy. Negative Nancy. I like it. I call mine Stella. She looks a little bit like my mom. Not exactly. Sorry, mom. But a little bit, right? But but if you can create that avatar for yourself, right? What they what they look like, what they sound like, that all that negative, it's not you, it's Nancy, right? And if you can challenge yourself when you hear that negativity, it's like, stop it, Nancy, shut up. Shut up. This is no ma'am, right? This is not the time for you. And we have to shut that down. So when we can kind of separate ourselves from it, I think that can be really helpful. And I think we have to reframe it to the positive.

SPEAKER_01 17:54

Yeah. And if you think about it like um the through the lens of what have you achieved? Why are you valuable? What are what's great about yourself? Because we don't spend time really thinking about that, then it also gets easier to challenge that other critic, that voice for me, Nancy. And if think about if if you out in the wild in real life ran into someone that was saying those things to you, you would slap them. Exactly. Something would be happening.

SPEAKER_00 18:24

It was somebody would need bail money, that's all I'm saying. Like you wouldn't listen to them. Right. Well, and imagine if they said that to your child, like to your daughter. Oh, I'd be gonna do that. Or to my nieces, right? Even to your best friend. If somebody said that to them, you're not experienced enough, you're not smart enough, you're not thin enough, you're not pretty enough, holy smokes, we would have an absolute fit, but we allow ourselves to hear it all the time.

SPEAKER_01 18:47

Yeah. Which in real life, I would just say, fuck you, and walk away. In my head, I'm not doing that, but I should. Right. And whatever you ruminate on, the what you spend time thinking about, you'll get more of. So you have to flip the script, you have to stop thinking only negative things about yourself for that kind of situation to then start reframing it in a more positive way. And over time, if you keep challenging that and you use that feeling as a starting place for growth, then you'll overcome it.

SPEAKER_00 19:22

Right. I don't, and I think it's it's normal that we have that negative voice in our head. The challenge is how do you respond to it, right? So getting to the root cause so that we identify, and then I think flipping the script and and I really am a big believer that if you if you were to take that minute or three minutes and write down the negative, I would challenge you after that to take the same amount of time and write down your accomplishments. What are the things that you're proud of that you've accomplished? You won an HR Star Award last year. That's an accomplishment. You started a business from scratch, that's an accomplishment. You were a single mom and raising two kids. That is an accomplishment, right? I was named into the Speaker Hall of Fame. That is a that is an achievement. That's amazing, right? Every one of you that's listening to this, you have accomplishments. You have wins. What are they? Write those down. And it can, it doesn't have to be work-related. It could be that you are really good at handling, you know, dealing with a difficult family member, or maybe you make the best carrot cake on the planet. What are those things that you're really good at? What are the the achievements that you've met, the things that you've accomplished? You got that job. You walked into that interview and you and you did it. You you are there for a reason. And when we start to then kind of see the successes, and I do think it's muscle memory, meaning that it doesn't have to be in the same area that you have the imposter syndrome, right? Uh those muscle memory, our our brain remembers the success. It remembers the win. So when that negative Nancy, when that Stella, whoever your voice is, starts talking to you, say, shut the heck up, I don't want to hear that, and remind yourself of what is that thing that you've accomplished, what is that thing you've done? Have whatever it is for you. And I think if you promise yourself that you're going to reframe it, you're gonna look at differently and you're gonna be willing to take risks. And that's promises made, promises kept, right? I I find that it's remarkable how we we will never break a promise to uh other people, right? If you promise your boss you're gonna have that done, you'll have that done. If you promise that coworker you're gonna have that taken care of, you will have that taken care of. If you promise your kid you'll be at that, you'll be at that. But we break promises to ourselves all the time. And I do think that when we do that, it impacts our, it impacts our confidence and it impacts our our feeling of value. We feel less valuable when we don't keep the promises that we make. Make to ourselves.

SPEAKER_01 22:01

Yeah, and everybody's value system is different too. So uh for me, if I could bake bread, like if I could get a sourdough starter and keep it alive, that would be a huge accomplishment for me. I would feel confidence in that. If I could keep a plant alive. I've killed more plants. I really try. I'm just I just think of them as temporary.

SPEAKER_00 22:26

This is gonna be my plant for a few weeks next.

SPEAKER_01 22:29

My my house is where plants go to die. I don't mean for it to be that way, but uh that is if I wanted to improve my skills in that, I could. Sure. I could go and look up, you know, gardening. I could talk to people in the neighborhood that have beautiful plants and and flowers in their yard. There's things I can do about it now. I'm I'm choosing not to.

SPEAKER_00 22:49

But well, you've only got so much time and energy.

SPEAKER_01 22:53

Exactly. But there's priorities. If if I felt bad enough about that, that would be a catalyst for me. I would then say, okay, well, now let me do something about it. So the things that matter to me, that's what I want to challenge when I feel like I'm an imposter and I'm not. And I really do think because you wouldn't talk about your best friend that way, about a family member that you love that way, sometimes you do just need to call the BFF and say, Hey, gas me up. This is how I'm feeling right now. And you better believe they're if if they're really a friend, they're gonna tell you all the ways that you are incorrect and you are amazing and knock it off.

SPEAKER_00 23:31

I agree. I I think that if we tap into, you don't have to know everything because everything, and Marie Forleo says this, everything is figure outable. So, and I believe that about myself. I believe I can figure it out. If I really wanted to do it, I could figure out y'all. You information is everywhere. You anything that you want to know, to learn, it's on the internet and it's free. You can go to YouTube and get YouTube videos for anything. It's for more than cat videos. Exactly. Everything is figure outable. So instead of beating ourselves up for what we don't know or not being where we want to be, everything is figure-otable. Go figure it out then. What do you need to learn? The there is, and I don't I can't name the source, but I'm sure I'm not the only one that's heard this. When it comes to applying for jobs, that that what we find is that if a woman is applying for a job, she feels like she has to have 100% of the stated qualifications to even bother to apply. She has to have all of them already. Men, on the other hand, though, they if they have 60, 65% of the qualifications, they will apply because they figure, eh, I can learn it. I can figure it out as I go. I don't really need to have that. But y'all think about how that is holding us back, right? If we are only taking action when we are 100% sure, you you're never gonna take any action.

SPEAKER_01 25:05

What are you gonna learn anyway?

SPEAKER_00 25:07

Exactly. Confidence doesn't come from always knowing, it's taking the action and figuring it out along the way. It's being willing to just give it a shot, right? I think you have to focus on action, not on identity, right? So action means what can I do? How can I figure this out? What can I do with this? Rather than I'm not that good at that. I've never been good at that. Those things, man, we hold on to them. And again, they they come from crazy places. They can and they stick with us. I mean, it is really, it's really amazing how those young, those traumas that happened early on, villain origin stories, how those things take off and become something that we don't even realize we're holding on to. And we got to focus, stop focusing on the emotion of it and focus on the action that's gonna get you where you need to be.

SPEAKER_01 25:55

I agree. Use it as data and make a plan from there. So, what are how would we kind of summarize what our biggest tips on overcoming imposter syndrome are? And then also like you're just you're not alone. Most everybody is just making it up as they go and feeling the same way.

SPEAKER_00 26:12

Yes, that's probably the biggest thing I hope that when people are listening to this, they it I hope every single listener had a moment where they're like, holy crap, I felt that, or holy, you know, I thought that too, or oh my gosh, I thought that was just me. It we all struggle with that self-talk, how we talk to ourselves. It's what you do after that that makes the difference. So I would say recognize that that the self-talk happens, but how can you reframe it? And I think sometimes that starts with, and I really do recommend it as an actual exercise, is write, give yourself a time limit of and write down all the negative things you say, and then write down all the positive things, your accomplishments, your achievements, the things you're good at, the things you feel good about, and allow that to become the confidence file, right? It's like a booster, it's a confidence file. So when you're not feeling it, when your emotions are overwhelming, you're feeling like that imposter, go, you can kind of dig into your mind and go back to that confidence file. And it gives you something that you can tap into to remind yourself of the how far you've already come and all of the things that you've already accomplished. And I think that's so powerful.

SPEAKER_01 27:17

I love it. I also think instead of coming at things from a lack mentality, because even though we'd say you shouldn't compare yourself, we know you're gonna look at it as this is something I want to aspire to. If I'm in the room with the executives and I feel like they're a level above me, well, what do I need to do to get on that level?

SPEAKER_00 27:39

Right. To me, that's the room I want to be in. Yeah. I don't want to be in a room with people that are where I'm the smartest person in the room. So I think that when you step into a room where you feel a little nervous, challenge yourself to feel like that is fantastic. Knowledge dump. Tell me everything. Teach me your ways. Yes, exactly. Be my Yoda. Guide me in the ways of a force, please. I love it. I would I would give one last takeaway. One, test this for yourself, right? Because I again, as we've talked about this, I feel like everybody can kind of relate to it. But I want to give you a like a 24-hour kind of courage challenge. So in the next 24 hours, I want everyone to try something new, do something different. Step into a room you've never stepped into. Um, speak up when you might not normally speak up. Send that email that you might not normally send or send, right? Own it and own it boldly. One of my favorite compliments I've ever gotten as a speaker was my tagline, my Julie Birch speaks, my tagline is solid business strategies, brilliant comedic humor. And I actually had somebody that brought me into an event to speak, and she told me afterward that she saw my tagline and she thought, wow, that was really cocky. Like that is really bold. I was really setting myself up because that was a pretty high bar. But she said, You really do. You really did do it. And I felt really good about that because I kind of knew that was a kind of bold and cocky thing to say. It's like, can I really get away with that? Brilliant. I don't know. Hell yeah. Right? Exactly. But I leaned in, and sometimes you just have to lean in. Step up, step in, and lean in. And I think there's value in that. The practice makes the habit. That's right. It gets more comfortable as you go. That's right. So we are, hopefully, everybody feels like you got a couple things on that. I'll tell you what we want to do. Uh, we are introducing a brand new segment on Breakthrough with Mallory and Julie. And we are calling it our fan mail five. Fan mail five.

unknown 29:46

Fan mail five.

SPEAKER_00 29:47

We need jazz. We do jazz. Exactly. A little background. Um, and the idea is this is that we can talk for 30 or 45 minutes, but we really want to engage with you. Uh, we want to be talking about things that are relevant to you and that matter to you. And that means that we need to hear from you. So we want to be able to have your questions. So our fan mail five is that we're gonna take a few minutes at the end of every episode and we're gonna answer your questions. You can email us directly. You can go to Breakthrough with Mallory and Julie, email us through there. You can go straight onto the show notes. There's a link. You can just click it, uh, share a comment, ask a question, any of our social. You can find us on social and ask us the questions. And our objective is that we're gonna we're gonna make sure that we're engaging and answering the questions to ask and talking about the subjects that are of most importance to you. So that's our objective. So we need to hear from you. So talk to us, talk to us, talk to us. We do have a question uh that came into us from uh Meg from Texas, and this is her question. So we're gonna read her question and then we're just gonna talk about, you know, what our thoughts are on it. So this is her question. How do you break through when you feel trapped, trapped? Like your ambition and drive just don't count against political donations that pull the reins, and your pension lurks in the background. That's a heavy question. Intense. Big.

SPEAKER_01 31:17

Yeah, high stakes.

SPEAKER_00 31:18

It is very much so. So, what are your thoughts on that when you hear that?

SPEAKER_01 31:21

Man. Matt, what would you say to Meg? Well, I always try to look at it from the lens of I can't control others, but I can control myself. What about the situation is within my control? Because if you feel powerless, it's hard to make moves from that mental space. Right. When you look at, okay, well, here's what I can do, then it might not solve the entire issue, but you do have more power and control back and you will start to feel a bit better about it. Um that's that is really tough. I think that you kind of have to outweigh the pros and the cons a little bit there too, and find stuff to look forward to. I think that when you're feeling depressed or a little bit of despair, it it's very heavy. So it you don't want to ruminate on that. Right. You want to think about what can I look forward to? Maybe that's leaving at the end of the day on Friday. But there's a light at the end of the tunnel that you can look forward to regularly.

SPEAKER_00 32:23

Right. That's absolutely true. I always feel like in these really heavy situations, and I do get questions like this periodically as I speak, and it in the most dramatic and the most heavy of these issues, these these big situations, I always feel like, and and people don't always want to hear this. So I'm kind of lovingly kicking you in your mindset here because I appreciate that this is not what people want to hear. But I do think it boils down to three options. You have three basic choices. You either stay as is, suck it up, buttercup, stay and deal with it. Or option two, you leave, you quit, you you go somewhere else, pension be damned, and you go. Um, or option three is you stay and you make smaller changes. So, and none of those are wrong. It's truly a process you have to work through. So when I think about stay and and suck it up, I always look at it like this is that, okay, so you look at it and you say, I hate this part of my job. I hate this piece of my job. I hate this person, I hate this project, I hate this situation, I hate this rule, I hate this part about my job. But I like everything else. Everything else is good. I like people I work with, I like my schedule, I like the flexibility, I like that I'm contributing to something big, that I'm making a difference in the world. If you can look at it and you can say, I really hate this, but I love all of this, if you love all of this and that's bigger than what you hate, then you can stay and you can feel good about that. That's there's no shame in your game. That's that's making it a real choice. You're weighing those pros and cons. You're looking at it that I like outweighs the I hate. Now, the flip side of that is that if you weigh that and you say, Well, I really hate this part of my job, I love this part of my job, but this part that I hate is too big. It maybe it's it just feels morally wrong, it feels ethically wrong, it's not in line with your values, it it is giving you physical pain, it's making you physically sick or ill. It it's too much. Then it's okay to choose to leave. Now, I do think that you weigh the pension. I mean, just specifically since the question Meg specifically said that about the pension, I appreciate that. Uh but I don't one of the things I'd look at is, you know, when are you gonna collect on that? How long do you have to stay to get it, right? Is it a year? Is it 12 years? That makes a difference. But even if you choose to leave, that doesn't mean, and I would never tell anybody, go in tomorrow and just say, ah, quit. I'm out of here. But start taking some actions that would move you in that direction. Because if you start looking at other opportunities, you start becoming open to other opportunities. You may discover that there's great things out there and that pension is not gonna be the deal breaker anymore. Or you may discover that I've actually got it pretty good. Maybe I'll focus on the positive. So one or the other. Now, the third option, of course, is that you stay and make changes. So you choose to stay, but that doesn't mean that you just take it as is. Really, and I think this speaks to what you were talking about, Mallory, is that you gotta look at what can I do? I don't control everything. I can't change that my boss is a jerk, but I can certainly change how I respond to my boss. I can choose to focus on the things that I like and that I enjoy. I can look for ways to minimize minimize interactions with people that I don't like or that bring me down. What are the small things that you can do that would help you feel better and reframe a little bit about the choice that you're making? Ultimately, though, that is the single biggest factor in how you handle the situation. When you focus on the fact that you don't control it, you have no say in it, it's going to be a negative. The minute you say, I'm choosing this, and here's why I'm choosing this, you're going to take ownership of it. It's agency over self. You're not allowing for the self-abdication, you're taking back control. And I think that is super powerful.

SPEAKER_01 36:20

And that's what we're all about.

SPEAKER_00 36:21

I I think so. I mean, I really think that is kind of what we want to focus on. So I think there's a lot to be said for that. Uh I always like to think of it that we're not here to make you comfortable. That's not what this is about. As a matter of fact, I want you uncomfortable. I want you to squirm a little bit when you hear what we say. I want you to feel like, oh man, I kind of do that sometimes. I kind of give up my power. I kind of let people change my attitude. I kind of let people, right, dictate how I'm feeling or what I'm thinking. And I don't want you to do that anymore. I want you to be uncomfortable because growth happens when we're uncomfortable. And ultimately, we're here to help you break through. So thank you for joining Breakthrough with Mallory and Julie.

SPEAKER_01 37:02

Before you go, please make sure that you like, subscribe, share with all of your friends, do all of the things. We appreciate it. And of course, submit your questions to us. Maybe next time we'll read yours.

SPEAKER_00 37:13

You never know. We want to hear them. Looking forward to it. Thanks, everyone. Bye. This episode is sponsored by Heron HR, the experts in full service payroll and HR built for growing businesses. Heron HR offers a white glove experience and specifically works with small and mid-sized businesses. Their easy-to-use HRIS system comes with all the bells and whistles you'd expect from a payroll provider, including applicant tracking, time, and labor management, electronic onboarding, performance management, and more. Heron HR is there to take on as much or as little of your HR function as you want and need. If you're ready for a solution that scales with you, if you need full service payroll or you just want a real HR partner, they've got you covered. Give them a call today at 1-800-607-7787 or find them online at heronhr.com.

SPEAKER_01 38:14

This episode is brought to you by Julie Birch Speaks. If you want another boring keynote, keep scrolling. But if you want an experience, meet Julie. Julie isn't just a speaker. She's the moment your audience didn't know they needed. With down home charm, a sharp sense of humor, and zero tolerance for fluff, she delivers real-world techniques that make people laugh, think, and actually do something different when they leave. Through relatable stories, bold truth telling, and solid business strategies, wrapped in brilliant comedic humor, Julie connects in a way that feels like a conversation, not a lecture. Your audience won't be just entertained. They'll be equipped, energized, and ready to level up. Solid business strategies, brilliant comedic humor. Find Julie online at JulieBirch.com or give her a call at 214-679-2717.